How To Make Money Online Waggling Your Ears

I watched an eye-opening tv show last night called who wants to be a millionaire on BBC2. Robert Kiyosaki and T Harv Eker were two of the gurus featured who make astronomical amounts of money. And a lot of it is from telling people how to have a millionaire mindset and how to become financially independent. There is a run-down of what the program contains here.

And some of it seemed to involve a lot of ear wiggling and waggling and stating that you had a millionaire mindset.  Or holding your leg and doing a dance. All while chanting out the mantra of wealth. Whatever mantra the Guru had decided was the one that would change your mind-set into one of positivity.

Rich Dad Poor Dad

I had never heard of it, but apparently this is like the most popular thing since sliced bread. I have never read a self help book in my life, or been to a seminar, or taken any notice of money making Gurus. But boy do these guys know what they are doing.

Rich Dad Poor Dad: What The Rich Teach Their Kids About Money – That The Poor And Middle Class Do Not!


Sort of, but it works for the ones leading the pack, there is no doubt about that. And the amounts that people pay for such courses is mind blowing. Absolutely staggering. Books, DVD’s, appearances and very expensive seminars are just the beginning.

But I have to say that certain aspects of Kiyosaki’s approach actually hit home. Why make your kids go to college if they could be earning more by dropping out of school? A valid point. We have become so conditioned to a certain way of living and of what society expects us to do that anything slightly different is seen as doomed to fail.

I would certainly have no qualms about teaching my children, if I had any, about how to make money online, and tell them to fore-go a college education entirely. Heck, I can make anyone a full time living from their teems on up if they followed the advice I gave them and actually did it, not just thought about it.

This way lies financial freedom. And independence from  the daily grind. An unconventional life where you set your own hours, deal only with people you want to, and reap some amazing rewards. Heck, if I told you how much we have earned, in 3 years, since I first turned on my computer to find out how to make some money you wouldn’t believe me. I find it hard to believe myself.

“a cross between Donald Trump and Buddha”

Secrets of the Millionaire Mind: Mastering the Inner Game of Wealth

That’s how T Harv Eker, the author of Secrets of the Millionaire Mind sees himself. He is all about getting people into the mindset of being a wealthy person in the making. Positive thinking and daily exercises.

Excuse me for my scepticism, it bemuses and amazes me.

I have never looked at this world before but it seems to be so popular that it is impossible to not look at it a little more closely.

Having had a little peek into this world last night I was somewhat floored by the amount of money people were actually spending in order to hear someone speak. People were in massive debt because they paid to hear someone tell them how to get rich. It was a complete contradiction.

I don’t understand but I do.

We want guidance, we want to be shown the way. We want someone to look up to. We want to be a success and we want to become rich. Rich beyond our wildest dreams. Rich so we can live the life we want to lead. And people pay for advice and “secrets”. And they get into massive debt and make the Gurus richer.

Here is what a UK source had to say about the show itself.

It made me sad to watch. Young kids of 18 with no money to their name, working a few hours a week in crap jobs yet paying thousands out to get advice from a couple of Dudes about how to become rich through a portfolio of properties. And the kids were adamant and confident that they would be millionaires.

How the hell will they even get a mortgage?

They have no money, no good income, and yet they are convinced.

This whole world of paying people for advice, and to hype you up until your head will explode with the idea of being so rich you can own a country is mental.

Kiyosaki even has a board game!

Rich Dad Cashflow 101 board game (with CD’s)

And people love it.

I don’t even know where this post is going, I was just floored by the whole thing so wanted to share.

Look Guys and Gals, if you want to earn a full-time living online then I can tell you how to do it.

Send me $500 and I will spend a day answering any questions you want via email. I will give you 8 hours of my time and tell you anything that you need to know.

But then I would be as bad as them wouldn’t I?

But I am honest in that I will tell you what I do know and what I don’t know. I don’t claim to have all the answers but I know how to make money online.

But then the Gurus do too don’t they?

Or do they make money by just telling people how to make money?


Waggle those ears Dudes.

74 Responses to “Gurus”

Read below or add a comment...

  1. James Hussey says:

    Clearly you’re no guru – for 8 hours you charge $5k. Silly.

  2. Ray says:

    These gurus do make their money telling others how to make money, they don’t even actually show you how they just tell you how. However there is some value in what they have to offer and that is the mindset change. For some folks its very hard to for them to think they can earn more than a regular paycheck.

    Their mind set is such that they believe they will always work for someone else, that they will always have debt etc.

    Yes most of the stuff these gurus push is crap but there are some nuggets of info that can help some folks liberate themselves from the limits of mental thinking they are accustomed to.


    • Dave says:


      Good points. That is why I found the whole thing so confusing. I am all for getting people to think differently about how they live their lives.

      I just got a bit worried by all the ear rubbing and morning mantras. Especially when the people were up to their limits in terms of debt because of paying for all the courses etc. It seems like a bonkers world so many of them were living in.

  3. Cat says:

    Didn’t see the TV show, but I’ve read books by both of them (went through a phase of reading a lot of self-help books a few years ago!). Kiyosaki in particular has a shady reputation, & a lot of Eker’s book reads like an infomercial for his seminars, but I must say I got a lot of value from the books. Coming from a family background with the usual ‘work a 9-5 for crap pay & struggle all your life’ kind of mindset, it was valuable to be exposed to something different, especially the concept of making money with your own business, and then putting it to work for you via investments etc.

    I don’t get the point of spending a ton of money on seminars though. The info is in the books for much less, and then it’s just a case of putting it into practice. I think that’s where a lot of people who are into the self-help thing get stuck though – they’d rather just take in more and more information and keep dreaming, but never actually take action on it. I’ve been guilty of that myself (just with books), but eventually you get to a point where you realise you’ve just got to *do* something!

    • Dave says:


      This was the thing. One person on the show was in massive debt and had wall to wall self help and Guru money making books galore. I couldn’t get my head around it. You can’t get rich by reading, you have to bloody do something.

      What I was really amazed at was how many people are willing to spend so much money to see these people live. It was astonishing, and they had massive followings that were incredible. People want to dream and they are willing to pay very good money for it. The Seminars were like religious meetings with their own chants and everything.

      • Carrie says:

        You can’t get rich by reading, you have to bloody do something.

        I think that is part of the problem. I would bet a large segment of these people are actually lazy and are looking for some “trick” to become rich.

        But the method for getting rich is usually the same – work hard, spend wisely, save, etc. There are a few people who stumble onto something big, but for most people hard work will be involved.

        Of course, we see this same behavior in IM. Newbies buying WSO after WSO trying to find the trick to making big money online when in reality they are just lining the pockets of the WSO sellers.

        Sounds like the biggest secret of these “Gurus” (online and offline) is learning how to milk money out of others by playing on their dreams. Oldest trick in the book.

        • Dave says:


          It is such a thorny issue. Part of me wants to believe they help some people by getting them to think positively. But then watching the program and seeing the troubles the people were in who had paid for all these courses really leaves you wondering. There is no doubt they were gullible people to some extent. But they believed in it. I kind of think that makes it even worse.

          • Isobel says:

            I’m not a fan of either of these two but I have done the “morning mantra” stuff – AKA meditation and appreciation journal. As a result of allowing new ways of thinking and TAKING ACTION on them, I live a lifestyle of MY dreams; it may not suit everyone else, but I live 15 mins from the Red Sea, I don’t have a J O B, I have a great social life and I’m deeply content and happy with my life probably 85% of the time, if not more. I’m not yet independently wealthy, but I live a darn sight better than I did in the UK.

            I agree with what Pedro says about paying to keep the dream alive; if you never get beyond the seminars, then you’re wasting your time and money. However, many people do have a glass ceiling that prevents them becoming all they could be, and sometimes it’s one of these seminars that will make the difference. For me, it was Mark Hughes and Jim Rohn (RIP) of Herbalife and it didn’t cost me anything 🙂 But without them, I wonder where I would be now.

            The mindset stuff is important Dave, and you know it really 🙂 If you don’t first BELIEVE you can have, do or be more, why would you even bother to try? Of course, the other side is those who consume the info and do nothing with it, whether it’s mindset or IM. There will always be people who read about it and never do it, whatever the subject, and there will always be those who make money out of them.

            An interesting read (and somewhat connected) is Seth Godin’s “We are all weird”.

            • Dave says:


              Wise words. I think I believed as soon as I got my first adsense click. Then I realized it was just a matter of scale. But boy, the scale can be pretty daunting at times 😉

      • Cat says:

        I came across this article yesterday, & immediately thought of this thread 😀

  4. Kelly says:

    Should have been outside the studio passing out flyers telling them they could get rich by joining a forum for just $10 bucks a month

  5. Pedro says:


    “The Dream” – People are paying for keep dream alive, not to act. Paying for be happy in 1 hour seminar, and after next seminar.

    Or paying for a book that can teach how to be a millionare in 30 days, but, they even have not read the book at all.

    Addict to the buy feeling – “Now I will can do if I buy this…”


    I believe there is a constant, that 80% to 95% of people in the world >> CAN NOT << decide and act to make dream come true, so, one person [aka boss] will decide what these people will do.

    You know, think and act are totally opposite.

    Better for people who work hard and smart.

    • Dave says:


      You may well be right. A lot of people simply need to be given rules and directions, they can’t make it being an entrepreneur.

      And judging by the show you may be right about the fact they were paying for some escapism. A short period of time where they were with others who had the same faith that they too could live in a mansion.

  6. Shaun L says:

    I’ve actually read that Rich Dad Poor Dad book, and got a lot out of it. It taught me the difference between an asset and a liability (Assets put $ in your pocket every month e.g. stocks or a website, liabilities take money out every month e.g. your mortgage or car) as well as some good theories on investing (Get in when the market goes down, stocks will be cheaper to buy but be worth a lot more when the market recovers).

    I actually witnessed this first hand during the credit crunch, the stocks i was buying were really cheap and now are worth a lot more then what I bought them for. I just wish I was brave enought to buy a LOT more, it was my first time buying stocks so I was a bit hesitant to invest bucket loads into it at the time. If the economy ever gets hit again though (Probably won’t happen again for another 50 or so years apparently, we go through say 2 recessions in or life) I’ll be investing a lot more heavily.

    But anyway, that book has changed the way I look at money, and has helped me live a better life for it. It has also helped in terms of the mentality it has given me, to know there’s another way of doing things and that you need to put the work in to make things happen.

    Having said that, I would never go on one of his courses. The book gives you the mind set you need and opens you up to new possibilities. If you can’t get going from that, you’re probably not enough of an action taker to make this work, no matter how much training you get.

    Like I said, the book’s great, and something I’m recommend to anyone. Any of the courses etc that come after that, leave it out and use that time and money to start building up your own assets. That could be your websites that earn a monthly income, stocks, buying and renting property (Not ideal for a lot of people due to the high start up cost and slow initial return), or anything else you can buy / build that will bring you in money every month.

    • Dave says:


      Good to hear form you Dude, and it is great that you have read the book. At the end of the day it is all about action I guess, not just continually looking for the magic potion. You are certainly a “doer” and that is the problem I saw in the show. Most were either dreamers or simply obsessed with the whole cult of changing your mind-set to become wealthy. But never actually doing anything apart from spending more money to buy more courses!

  7. Jason Kelley says:

    I have read most of the Rich Dad books and listened to most of his audio tapes as well over the last few years. It is true he doesn’t tell you A+B= big money which frustrates a lot of people who want to get rich quick.

    He does however give you quite a few things to think about to get people to think about their money and ideas so that they can start changing their perception on money and spending it.

    We have all seen people on tv who have came into millions of dollars only to loose it all in a few years because they have the spending habits of a poor person. He tries to teach people how to break these habits and get people to start thinking about how to spend their money on things that will earn them money.

    I really enjoyed his books and tapes which I still listen to on long trips from time to time. I wouldn’t however spend hundreds or thousands of dollars for the seminars, but the $15 book is well worth the money.

    just my 2 cents

    • Dave says:


      Good to have your insights. He actually sounds very much like me in his approach to money. I have always wanted any money I earned in a job to be put to good use. i.e to to try to get out of having a job 😉 At least in the conventional sense anyway.

  8. Jim says:


    Wow, you’re just now finding out about Rich Dad Poor Dad? I thought everybody and their dog had read that book by now. That’s very surprising (or maybe not? Maybe that’s why you preach hard work ;)). I read it many, many moons ago when I was a teenager and I do have to say, it’s had a lasting imprint on me ever since. It pretty much changed how I viewed a lot things in this world when it came to money matters.

    However, everything that came after his first book IMO is just a bunch of rehashed crap that for the most part serves no other purpose than to keep his money-making gravy train rolling. If I were to compare it to IM, his original RDPD book is like his main “money” site and all the other books and other stuff he does are like his crap “satellite/support” sites that don’t really provide any real value, but they exist because they allow him to make more money.

    It’s kind of funny that you mention him, and that you wrote a post about “gurus” because it seems like more and more you’re becoming like them, are you not? Especially now with your paying members only forum and your expressed intent to focus more on your e-books. Certainly nothing wrong with it and, if anything, it’s another way to diversify your income. But I do have to wonder, is it an explicit goal of yours to expand/focus more on and monetize your “how to make money online” niche?

    What has me worried is that there may come a day when you can earn a greater return for every hour spent telling others “how to make money online” than you can earn spending that same hour doing the things you tell other people to do. Because that IMO will be the day when the rest of us IMer’s are doomed.

    Because that to me will signal that one side of your pie is shrinking.. and if it’s shrinking for you, it’s definitely shrinking for the rest of us. Hopefully, that day will not come.

    But as an IMer, I and a lot of you others out there probably know as Dave has alluded to it many times, this game is gradually getting harder and harder by the day. And not only that, the game we’re playing is one of the riskiest money making games out there, where obscure notions like “stability” and “long-term” don’t really exist. What we build today could be gone tomorrow. We’re all treading on dangerously thin ice, that may collapse any day now without notice.

    And because of this, it really makes me wonder whether we’re truly better off than your typical desk jockey/corporate drone/worker bee? The very people that the “gurus” tell you not to be like. Sure, the type of work we do is unconventional, but most of us arguably work just as hard, if not harder than them. The fact that we have to work hard isn’t the issue though – all successful people do. One of the main tenets espoused by just about all of the business gurus out there is that you have to build an “assset” – which I fully agree with. All real world businesses involve growing and developing an asset, be it real estate, a factory, a brick & mortar store with equipment, etc. That’s what ultimately allows you to leverage your time and effort, allowing you to create/have “something” other than just income. Something that will have real, lasting, and intrinsic value.

    I feel like with the whole IM/making money online game, there is no “asset” part of it, other than the income I earn from it, and I’m simply just trading my time for money like any nine-to-fiver. Now I’m obviously not referring to “real” sites, brands, and online businesses like Amazon, or other service oriented sites like fiverr. I’m talking about your typical affiliate marketer, blogger, spammer, and such who represent 99% of the Google SERPS for any given search query.
    The closest thing we have to something resembling intrinsic value are EMD’s, where an analogy could be made that they are similar to owning a piece of land or real estate. But Google could choose to devalue them at any moment, and when the value of an “asset” is at the whimsical mercy of another entity in such a way, it’s hardly an asset nor does it have any intrinsic value.

    And this brings us to the question of, how exactly should we invest in our IM business? And how much? Should we be using the money that we make in IM and investing it in real world businesses/assets that have tangible, intrinsic value? The “gurus” out there differ on how one should invest. Some say diversify, others say specialize/concentrate your efforts on one thing. I’d love to get your thoughts on this Dave, especially since you’re one of the bigger players in the IM world (at least among those who are vocal), and I’m curious to know how others feel about investing in a “business” that is so unstable and the long-term sustainability/viability of which is constantly in doubt.

    I realize this is a very long and rambling comment and I’m not even sure if it has any correlation to your original post lol, but it’s definitely been a long time coming, especially after some of your recent post entries and how I’ve sensed a shift in the general tone of your posts. Honestly, I could probably go on and on, but I will end it here. Will look forward to your next post/comment.


    • Cat says:

      long ramble ahead…

      I have been thinking about this too. I think that if you’re building a top quality information site that is (or will be) up there with the best in its niche, you are building a real asset. Such a site won’t be dependent on search traffic alone, and it could usually be monetised in various ways, and – if you want to – sold for a big chunk of change further down the line. Obviously, this depends on really knowing what you’re talking about (or hiring writers who are experts and being willing & able to pay more than $5 an article!). And let’s face it, many if not most ‘IMer’ sites don’t fall into this category, quality-wise – either because the site owners aren’t prepared to put the work in, or they just don’t know how to provide top-notch content. And I know ‘quality’ is subjective, but most of us can spot an average IMer site a mile off, and I’m sure I’m not the only one who makes a point of ignoring them in the SERPS, in favour of ‘real’ sites.

      Having said that even if you have a great site, you’re not immune to algo changes. When the Panda updates began, there were complaints on the Google forums from owners of very prominent, successful sites who’d suffered collateral damage. G may say they want the ‘best’ sites on the front page, but their SERPS don’t reflect this, at least not at the current time. They may be continually trying to improve the algo and provide better search results in general, but they don’t care about the fate of any individual site, no matter how useful it is. So any business model that depends entirely on Google, or any other single traffic source, is suicidal in the long run, IMO. I’m glad my sites were hit by Panda (most have recovered), since it was a good wake up call.

      Personally, I’ve come to realise that I’m not willing to spend years on end writing every day. I can write decently and like to think I could make a really great site with a few years of sustained effort, but I just don’t enjoy the process enough. My sites are focused around my passions, but I’d rather be *doing* those things than writing about them! So to that end, I’ve changed direction so I’m actually doing what I like, and am just starting to make some money from it. I’m still building assets of a different kind that will provide passive income for years to come, but now I’m enjoying the process too. My IM sites are still earning, and hopefully that’ll continue for a year or so while I get my new projects off the ground. I’ll still add to my sites when I feel like it, but I don’t see them as my long term income source any more.

      Now I’ve gone way off the original topic, but my point is that I think that a truly sustainable business is often built around doing something you both enjoy, and can provide lasting value with – or at least it is in my case. I know a lot of people pooh-pooh the idea of loving what you do, and I realise there are some interests that are hard to monetise, but it makes it so much easier to put in the hours and keep going when there’s nothing coming in to begin with. I admire the work ethic of those like Dave and some others here who seem to be able to make themselves sit down and do what needs to be done day after day, even if they’re bored out their brains. But I suspect more people are like me and just don’t have the self-discipline to sustain that kind of action over the long term, if there’s not also some reward from the work itself other than the prospect of earning lots of money. So any new people thinking of getting into this game, or any business really, should be completely honest with themselves about what motivates them. If you just want to make some quick cash, go into it with your eyes open and don’t delude yourself that gaming the SERPS with a bunch of crappy sites with 3rd-rate regurgitated content is the same thing as building a sustainable business.

      If I was staying in the IM game, I’d definitely be squirreling away as much money as I could while the going is good, and investing it elsewhere (but *where* exactly, is a whole other topic lol). Really, that’s a good idea no matter what type of business (or job) you’re in. There are no guarantees anywhere.

      • Jim says:

        I agree with a lot of what you wrote. However, it’s not really the panda or algo updates per se that worries me. If your site drops (regardless of what the reason is) then it just means your competitors took your place. You’ll have to play the game better to beat them.

        What concerns me is that there may come a day, when something like what happened with Adwords, happens to search – where they basically won’t even allow you to “play the game” anymore, or they make it so difficult that it no longer becomes worth paying it. Basically if you don’t know, back in the day, everybody was allowed to use adwords to promote affiliate sites, or promote whatever you wanted. There was no minimum bid or quality score or any of that nonsense. But then Google changed all that when they introduced the aforementioned which made it virtually impossible for the average “IMer” to make a living using it, and also began arbitrarily mass banning Adwords accounts. Only “corporate” type accounts and others with very deep pockets were allowed to keep “playing the game.”

        I feel like something similar to this is bound to happen with search. Perhaps not on the same scale, but a similar “weeding out” process I believe will be implemented. I really don’t want to speculate on specifically what that might entail, but I could possibly see a day coming where Google might implement their own “quality score” (which will of course not be based on any objective criteria) for SERPS, and will be used as a pretext by Google to not even show your site in the SERPS at all. Or maybe they’ll stick all of those affiliate sites on “supplemental results” pages and only show like 5 or 10 sites for commercial queries. Who knows. Again, I have no idea exactly how the weeding out process will work or what form it will take, but when/if that happens, the vast majority of affiliate marketers and the like are not going to survive.

        The reason I believe this is because I still see so much crap in the SERPS, it’s kind of funny at times. 9 times out of 10 when I go to study a competitor and their backlinks, I see nothing but crap/spun content that serves no other purpose than to provide a backlink.

        Don’t get me wrong though, I’m not really making any statement about the “ethicality” of it or whatever – they’re just playing the game. We all do the same thing (anybody who dominates their niche does anyway). We’re all just playing the game.

        But at the end of the day, we’re just middle men, who in Google’s eyes (and quite frankly my eyes as well) the value we provide is questionable. Dave commented that in his niches, large e-commerce sites, i.e. “real sites”, are gaining massive ground in the SERPS. I’ve also read other people stating the same elsewhere although I haven’t seen this personally in my own niches.

        Having said all this, though, I love the game and I intend to continue playing it until it ends or I’m forced out. But I think we will continue to see more and more “culling out” periods and the number of IMers will dwindle over time as only the best will survive.


        • Cat says:

          Yes, I remember Google doing that with Adwords. It didn’t affect me, but I recall the big fuss about it. I wouldn’t be suprised if they eventually try something similar with organic results. I do think a lot of affiliates provide great additional value with their sites, especially when they really know the niche and have used the products they talk about. It would be a shame if they were forced out of the results & only e-commerce type sites were left, since not everyone who looks for product information wants to buy it right then.

          But at the same time, it’s very frustrating as a searcher when you’re trying to find information about something and the SERPS are clogged with thin sites just rehashing stuff they’ve found elsewhere, without adding anything original or useful. I’ve been doing a lot of research for some things I want to buy lately, as well as just looking for information, and have come across tons of junky affiliate or Adsense sites. I felt embarrassed to be part of that problem – I’ve always tried to do better than that with my sites, but I know I’ve put my share of mediocre stuff out there over the years too.

          It’ll certainly be interesting to see how things evolve over the next year or two.

    • Dave says:


      Great comment Dude.

      OK. First, let’s clear one thing up. I am not a player in the IM world. I am super small fry with hardly any subscribers, and I mean hardly any, and not a great deal of traffic either to be honest. I have never set out to be a big guy and in all honestly I am too shy to take it to any kind of big level. And that is the truth.

      What I am doing, and I have always tried to be upfront about this, is to try to ensure that if earnings that rely on search traffic dried up to nothing that I could still have a comfortable lifestyle and I can. I can give you some figures if you want.

      I get about $1000 a month from this site and the old one from recurring commissions and about $2500 from the forum. But I have no idea if the forum will be a winner long term, although I must admit it is a frankly amazing place. But it in no way is good use of my time. I spend a lot of time in there and have made thousands of posts, and I would get a much better return by building sites (at the moment). And then I earn about $300 or so a month from 3 Kindle books. 2 in the IM niche. My plan in the new year is to drastically increase what I earn from Kindle books, but they are not set up to earn specifically from anyone that has heard of me.

      They are to earn from people searching on Amazon or find the books listed in search. I want to increase this for my own peace of mind and to have a steady income, even if it is not massive by others standards. One thing I am pretty sure of is that I will never earn that much by telling people how to make money online in comparison to my other stuff. I don’t have the personality for it and certainly don’t have the inclination to put myself forward in a way that would be needed.

      As far as this business goes and relying on search, it is a dangerous game. To some degree most of us are always chasing the next algo change, the next up and coming Web 2.0 and on and on it goes. I kind of like it. Keeps me on my toes. For me personally I can’t think of a better way to earn a living. I answer to no-one, no-one at all. If I needed to start all over again then I would. But people do need to ensure that they are looking out for their futures. If you earn good money I would invest it in something very stable long term. Property is what we will buy, I haven’t got the stomach for the stock market etc. But I would advise anyone, whatever job they have, to make sure there is a point to it.

      When I had a “real” job I would save all I could, and the Wife too. I never saw the point of busting a gut for an idiot boss to then just go and blow a weeks wages on a shirt. I could have stayed ant home and done without the shirt and been a lot happier. And this is the problem for a lot of people. Life gets stressful and we are conditioned into believing that “things” make us happy. I don’t agree with it at all. I want a happy life, rich or poor, and now it is pretty good. Because of my lovely Wife and some money in the bank. But I know what I would choose if I had to.

      Um, guess I am rambling too!

      So, never followed the guru thing so never heard of any of those guys.

      No one visits my blog and I don’t really care, and I love my new Pond. Bugger the money, it is not the reason for it primarily. Not that it will ever be free 😉

      Wanna buy my latest book?

      • Norm says:


        You deserve the success of what you have created and I admire what you have done. I dont think you need to justify what you have done to anyone in my opinion.

        Someone who brings value to ones life or help is worth every acolade or reward the receive. Just like Robert K., his books are great, it has inspire me into taking action in life.

        Everything we read are just ideas until we set forward to implement. The key is inspiration, many may not be as successful as Robert but you know if it inspires that individual to create more in their own lifes good on him.

        Moving on … for people inspiring to get into this industry

        Just like Dave, I love this industry and wouldnt go back full time job ever, unless s^^^ hits the fan. Since leaving a high paying corporate job about 18 months go, I basically started from the bottom again. The only thing you need to know is put the effort now and be rewarded later is the key. It may take a while but once it gets there … party time. Stay motivated and work. One example I will share.

        I mention previously in a post one of my sites took 10 months, i.e. like this month to actually make BANK. Now I know it works time to repeat this strategy from 1 to 100 similar sites. 😉

        Read stuff, try it and see if it works 😉 Once it works repeat. Also dont just follow one strategy do as many as you can. I currently have 4-5 working models/strategies.

        I will be joining the POND soon as well,so see you all there.


        • Dave says:


          It will be great to have you in there Dude. And working on a number of different business models is exactly what we should all be striving for. Especially if we want to guarantee we never ever have to work for the MAN again. Urgh.

      • Jim says:


        When I meant that you were one of the bigger players in the IM world, I was referring to your affiliate/amazon/adsense income and success in that arena, and not the “how to make money online” niche, which I place in a different category.

        Surely, you would admit that you are one of the more successful IMers (surely in the top 1%) just based purely on total income derived from online activities?

        My point was, and what I was asking is, as one of the more successful IMers and as someone who makes a lot of money online, how does someone like you invest your money with regards to your online “business”? But I guess you’ve answered it – you stated you will be investing in property.

        Which is interesting to me because I am getting the impression that you don’t invest a significant portion of the money you earn from your sites back in to your online business. Most people who own real world businesses, you don’t typically see such a reluctance to invest back into the business. And that was the point that I was getting at, if anybody missed it. I, personally, am very apprehensive about re-investing a SIGNIFICANT amount of my profits back into the “business”, and I see that in a lot of my competitors as well. Maybe we all realize that this game is just too dangerous to do so, and that if we put more money into the game, the “casino” will take it right back.

        Personally, I feel that there’s a huge difference between “real world” business, like when, say, a business owner expands his business by buying a piece of land or a building to open up a new store that contains tangible equipment/inventory, and when an IMer “expands” his business by buying more articles and domain names.

        I don’t know, maybe it’s just me.


        • Dave says:


          I invest back into this what I think I need to. We have spent a few thousand on aged domains and the like. But yeah, you are right, nothing on the scale of what we earn really. I don’t feel the need to really. In fact I want to scale right back and work with a lot less sites etc.

          And as to being a big player in terms of earnings. I doubt it really. Have you seen how much people earn who are into paid traffic? They earn so much money it makes your brain hurt.

          But you are right, this is a very temporary game to some degree. But only if you rely on search. Which is why diversity is key. If there was something I felt suitable I would spend money on it. But I would never buy a site for a lot of money if it relied on search, I know what can happen from one day to the next.

    • Shaun L says:

      Having websites online is definitely an asset, an asset is anything that brings in money instead of taking it away. I have websites I haven’t touched in well over a year that still make money every month.

      No asset is 100% secure, are stocks guaranteed to make you money? Is property? Both of those could end up losing you money as well as making it, but that doesn’t make it any less of an asset if it’s making you money at the time.

      As with property and stocks, there’s a risk involved in IM. You can minimise that risk by creating recurring income products, building your list, and not fully relying on search engines (As well as other things). Most of all, make sure what you offer is of good value and has multiple ways to monetize from different traffic sources.

  9. Liam says:

    If we’re selling omelette makers or ab-exercise machines on Amazon we’re really doing the same thing though aren’t we? Flogging people stuff 90% never use but gives the fleeting feeling they have done something to improve their life.
    You don’t need a machine to make an omelette and you don’t need a machine to get fit and lose weight. Just bloody do it.

    If the purchaser gets aggrieved about a product they bought then fair enough, have a go at the seller. But if the purchaser isn’t complaining, is of sound mind and goes back for more, who are we to judge that they’ve done the wrong thing for them? Isn’t that a bit paternalistic?

    That said, there is a case for sales people to be a hell of a lot more ethical. Especially in the make money and health industries.

    • Dave says:


      What you say is totally true. There is just a fine balance between value for money and giving people what they want and actually making their life worse whilst promising the opposite. It is an impossible ethics situation. If someone said they would give me ten grand if I told them how to make money online then I would take it. But if they failed to follow though that is their fault right? My problem with what I saw was that it seemed so much based on hype and no real plan. But then, people were happy to pay and believed they got their money’s worth. And here in the comments the books have changed peoples lives.

      As I said in the post, I don’t even know what I think about it all really, it just boggles my brain to be honest.

  10. Seth says:

    The problem with property is that you never truly own it because you will always owe taxes on it. And in many places in America, property values have gone down 30% to 50%. Just as scary as stock me thinks.

    • Dave says:


      It has dropped a lot in the UK too, which is why it is a good time to buy. Long term though you will always have a steady income from rental if you own property. Plus money if you ever need to sell. But really it is just to make sure that you do something with your money, not just squander it, which I am sure you don’t.

      Or maybe you are a Playa and like wining and dining the ladies with Champers and driving sports cars?

      • As someone once said – they are not making anymore land! Particuarly in the UK with your population density, land is going to always be worth something, and I agree, not a bad time to be looking to buy. Are you going to invest or move back?

        • Dave says:

          Liz we are going to move back but still keep our place here in Spain too. Best of both worlds then. We can come and go as we please.

  11. Tracey says:

    Like others I read (and think I still own somewhere) the original Rich Dad Poor Dad book.

    I actually liked it from a different perspective in that he always had an entrepreneurial spirit from a kid (selling stuff to the neighbours) to an adult (self pubbing the Rich Dad Poor Dad book and selling it at petrol stations).

    I think most of us here have that same ‘spirit’ of wanting to do things ourselves and not working for others.

    It made me see the potential of taking risks and following your dream.

    Of course I DID NOT see the value in paying $10,000 for some seminar (WTF!)

    The people that pay this kind of money are the same kind that buy WSO after WSO. They want an easy solution and are not willing to put in any effort at all then complain that the program doesn’t work. Of course it didn’t because you didn’t put the work in.

    I’m probably a bit harsh, but if someone in debt is prepared to pay $10K+ for a seminar they can’t afford then they deserve what they get. Seriously where’s the personal responsibility?

    I’m not saying that some people are not scammed, certainly they are, but you’ve got to know that you are in debt so do you really think getting in more debt (especially if he already had a stack of selp-help books on his shelf) is going to be the answer. Wake the F Up!

    Ok, rant over.

    But I haven’t heard of Eker. Hmm might have to look him up 😉

    • Dave says:


      You hit it spot on. That was exactly the situation the people in the show were in. I couldn’t believe it. I guess it is the attitude that is becoming more and more prevalent to debt that is my concern. I have always done anything I could to avoid it. But some seem to actively embrace it and be proud that they have a nice wardrobe (for example) but a huge credit card bill.

      • Maybe its cause you’ll getting old Dude, I would have the same reaction. I’ve always said that I was lucky that I was broke when I started doing IM – I couldn’t afford to buy expensive products so I didn’t lose big money – and then I get emails from people who went into debt for the guru launches??? WTF, I’ve decided you just can’t help some people!

        • Dave says:

          Yeah, I still have never bought any products about making money online, and I think it is probably best that I never had money when I was starting. It would be so easy to fall into buying all the shiny things. Good job I am still tight too!

  12. Rahul says:

    Well we cann’t change the world. More we try, more we will be stressed. I bought some marketing package (profit storm) from warrior last month, so, that i understand what is affiliate marketing. I found decent still theme was same but i leanred few tips. Which i am using on daily basis for my niche sites.

    I tried backlink philipins (because you told many times that it works) two days back and found my site regained position on serp in two days. So, normal person want short cut. If we get right thing and right tip to make money online. we will follow or else we need to spend time and learn. That’t other do.

    People don’t take risk, they think making money online is impossible. They want to make money in easy way. Not spending and investing time. They think selling some toys as joke. So, they will beleive only when you will show them real proof. Proof should not be less then $3k/month in my understanding.

    Finally when we learn all those work after years of struggle. Do you really want them to get all those info for free? When you give them free, people don’t value them and they fail and blame system.

    • Dave says:


      No, I don’t think it needs to be free information. But what you pay should be within your means and it should be what it says it does on the tin. I don’t know if the seminars and books from these guys delivers, I haven’t seen or read them. It was just a crazy world where a lot of people were spending what they didn’t have, and time and time again.

      It says as much about them as the Gurus themselves.

  13. Matt says:

    The premise of the Rich Dad / Poor Dad books is a lie. He never had a Rich Dad. Kiyosaki was heavily involved in Multi-Level Marketing and saw an opportunity to sell a different kind of “magic juice” in the form of advice about how to be rich. As has been said by many others, there is no magic juice that makes you rich. I completely disagree with the idea that you simply must change your mindset. Its not a matter of “thinking rich” its a matter of taking small risks that allow you to earn a return. You must explore different ideas and test them. You may lose some money in the process but the important part is to make the risks small. That’s the real benefit of Internet Marketing. The risk is small. It’s primarily your time. Read Dave’s blogs, do some keyword research, then start crunching 500 words a day on a free Web 2.0 property. Backlink. Wait. If you get traffic,build on it. If not, try a new keyword. Low investment cost. Low risk. As you make money, start buying your own properties and building those out. Again, with a few hundred dollars in total (far less than the cost of an MLM) you can build out a property. It’s mostly about time. I do think that Internet Marketing is reaching a saturation point and when it does there will be a certain amount of consolidation where people with skills and knowledge will be able to leverage that and buy out the smaller players. We’ll see. Anyway, just my quick and jumbled thoughts.

    • Dave says:


      And they are appreciated Dude. I think you are going to be right, the Web is going to be a very different environment in a few years as more and more people are chasing all the keywords. I wonder just how much work people are going to continue to put into ranking? Maybe the algos will totally change and we are never going to be able to rank if we haven’t already had an online presence for some time.

      Interesting times ahead.

    • Shaun L says:

      I heard that the story isn’t fully true either. Having said that, I think it was an effective way to get his point across and I didn’t learn any less because of that. Therefore I’m not too bothered if the story isn’t 100% true.

      I agree you can’t get rich just by changing your mentality, but you do need the right mentality to increase your chances of finding a better way to make money and to MAINTAIN that money once you make it. A lot of people wouldn’t be able to do that second part: The more money they make, the more money they spend. Then they wonder why they’re always struggling for money.

  14. Bruno says:

    Like some people here, I read most Kyosaki books when I was young and I believe if you have never, ever, read a book like that, than you should. It has certainly taught me a lot of stuff and there are still a cup of quotes which have stuck in my mind like:

    “A real leader’s job is to manage people who are smarter than him.”

    And many others.

    But honestly, I think this guy is full of cr*p and the only money he has ever made was selling his books and seminars (for which he charges outrageous fees). There was even some researches about his “rich dad” that he keeps banging about throughout his courses and no evidence whatsoever was ever found that this guy really existed – and it wouldn’t be that hard to find it.

    This Eker’s guy: never heard of him, but I got his audio book and listened to it this week. My advice (if you have already read rich dad or similar books): don’t waste your time!

    Full of empty expressions like “You can do it if you believe you can!” (Really!?) or “You need to first grow from the inside to transform your outside!”

    It’s a bit like MMO crap books: these phrases all make sense in a way and they are indeed true (you really need to believe HARD that you can accomplish anything!), but after a while they become just empty advice which is not really actionable.

    I believe my time is better spent reading books about REAL business people who we don’t even have the guts to ask “Did these people really succeed?”

    For example, two of the best books I’ve ever read:

    — “Losing my Virginity”, Richard Branson: a must read!
    — “How to Get rich”, Felix Dennis; don’t be fooled by its title, this is one of the best books out there. Felix tells all the truth that guys like Kyosaki and Ever would never tell you. Besides, there are some great funny gems like this one:

    “If it flies, flotas or fornicates, I rent it. It’s cheaper on the long run.” Felix Dennis

    I believe I’m better off reading that kind of book and books from great authors like Peter Drucker, Jim Collins, Dan Kennedy, Kotler, etc.

    Or if you want to find the source of all those “the millionarie/rich mindset”, then read the very first one;

    “Laws of Success in 16 Lessons”, Napoleon Hill: free to download. This is one great book. It’s a bit long and sometimes he rambles a bit too much, but still one of the best out there.

    Overall I think these guys sell similar Scam deals to people who just want a quick answer and encouragament and don’t really want to do much. I do believe in what they say and as I said, rich dad greatly influenced me and it is one book that I would recommend to friends and family – heck, I gave to my brother as a gift I believe Xmas last year!

    But spending over 1K in those seminars – no no!

    My 2c


    • Dave says:

      Cheers Bruno,

      I know you have read a lot and it is great to hear your take on the subject. Watching the show was such an eye-opener to me. I just totally forget there are these kinds of worlds out there. The main worry was the cult status. It really was like these guys could charge anything they wanted and people would pay it.

      It was just like they were blind to the truth. The money they were spending on Seminars could have actually been put into a business to get them started. But they were waiting for that golden bit of advice to make them a millionaire in a year or two’s time.

    • teatree says:

      One of the best books on making money is “Art of Money Getting” by P.T. Barnum (of circus fame) written in 1880.

      You can read the whole thing online free on the following link:

      IM people should pay particular attention to Chapter 19.

      • Bruno says:

        Dave, I concur. I guess is not very far from what we see in the IM industry: folks paying absurd amounts in the search for the golden nugget when they already have all the info they need and should just start working – HARD – on it!

        Teatree, thanks for that. Will certainly read it 😉

        Any other good books that you can recommend?

        1880? Already scored some points in my opinion 😉


      • Dave says:

        teatree, thanks will check it out.

      • Bruno says:

        Teatree, just finished reading the book. Indeed a good read.

        But I didn’t really get it why IM people should pay special attention to chapter 19 “Don’t blab”.

        Well, in a sense I do get it, especially if you take the definition for blab:

        “blab   [blab] Show IPA verb, blabbed, blab·bing, noun Informal .
        verb (used with object)
        to reveal indiscreetly and thoughtlessly: They blabbed my confidences to everyone.
        verb (used without object)
        to talk or chatter indiscreetly or thoughtlessly: Don’t confide in him, because he blabs. She blabbed so much I couldn’t hear the concert.”

        But if men were never supposed to tell their secrets, then we would have never learned all that Dave has taught us.

        But I guess your interpretation of that chapter is different than mine, so let me know what you think 🙂

        And please do share some other books that you might know.


        • teatree says:

          What did I mean by “don’t blab”? Well just that I have seen a bunch of techniques ruined because people couldn’t keep their mouths shut, and when it gets onto places like the Warrior Forum, and the ignorant wannabees pile on, you know you’ve got to change your strategy immediately because it’s only a matter of time before G hammers that technique. And if you haven’t moved, the hammer falls on your head – this applies to everything, backlink networks, adsense niche site techniques (who remembers X Factor?) and so on.

          For example, BMR used to work great, till they opened up to all comers and started paying high commissions to those who promoted it. Strangely it was once they started talking about it on WF that it started to lose effectiveness. I could go on and on.

          How do you learn if people don’t talk? By testing. Get yourself a bunch of cheapo new domains and then push the limits on them – it will reveal a whole bunch of things that you just can’t get taught. The more testing you do, the more “accidental” findings you make about G’s algo.

          • Bruno says:

            Coolio. I imagined it was something along those lines.

            I fully agree with that bit where you talk about testing things yourself: it is indeed the best way to find your way of doing thing in the web sewer.

            I’ve seen some really great progress the moment I started to try to intentionally get a site penalized. Obviously I did that to sites that I don’t care much and like you said, it teach you 100x more than any formatted strategy that is already on the known by WF and the like.

            A good and healthy rule to follow:

            ““Test everything, trust no one.”

            Even people with the best intetions in the world might be doing their tests wrong or maybe they are simply testing a niche completely different than yours which might make a HUGE difference. So …

            TEST, TEST, TEST

            Thanks for sharing 😉 Appreciated


  15. atma says:

    Sorry for an off topic, Dave, but what the picture do I see to the top right? LOL, do you follow Godaddy? Is it new “Zen Duck” Star? (sorry, could not help myself…:))))

  16. Rob Thomas says:

    Hey Dave

    I think many gurus are just after peoples money, however I do believe there are a few who genuinely do try and help, it is then up to the people whether they take action on there advice or not.

    On another note I am feeling very discouraged right now. The 1 orbs I had ranking on the first page for a long tail of a product in the top 5 of the toy section has been de-indexed by google.

    Does this only happen to me?

    This game really is getting hard.

    Rob Thomas

    • Dave says:


      That is a bit of an odd one, but yeah, it is getting harder by the day. You just have to spread yourself out on different platforms while also building up your own sites too. You will get there in the end Dude.

  17. Rachel says:

    I have read and can recommend a book “The Millionaire Fastlane” which Tracey recommended on her blog a while ago. The author MJ DeMarco wrote his book AFTER he got rich not as a RESULT of the book sales! Robert Kiyosaki’s enormous wealth is largely due to book, seminar, and board game sales. I know who I’d rather listen to (unless of course I wanted to be the next Kiyosaki)

    • Dave says:


      Thanks. I may actually check it out. Maybe it is time I read a few of these books. I wouldn’t mind being a millionaire 😉

    • Bruno says:

      Thanks Rachel. Will also check that out.

      It seems Pat Flynn interviewed him one day at his blog.


  18. Quinton Hamp says:

    Two thoughts for you, buried under all of these wonderful insights:

    #1 Dave, one thing Ilove about your blog is that you encourage your readers to take action, whether that’s with the $1,000 in 30 days post, or the $1,000 in one year…. you want us to move.

    “I dare you to move” – Switchfoot
    “An object in motion tends to remain in motion” – Newtons 1st Law

    Great mindset can be the starting point of great action. But action is what changes the world.

    #2 So what makes these guys so hot? Hope. Humans love hope. We love to hope that tomorrow will be better. We love to hope that we will not die in the next second. Hope keeps us looking towards tomorrow. It also blinds us.

    Its our way of mitgating our pain.

    And it surprising how much people will pay to mitigate pain.

    • Dave says:


      I guess that is the motivation behind it, the dream and the hope of changing your circumstances. If only they would actually ACT.

    • Lynn says:

      Hope blinds us, you say. I don’t think I’ve heard anything that explains my own situation to me so well. I “never give up” but lately I’m seeing that maybe my positive outlook is actually hurting me in a big way.

  19. Brett says:

    This was a fascinating show. While the gurus all touched upon elements of the law of attraction/positive thinking type of thing (which do work), a lot of it was just selling the offline equivalent of expensive cookie cutter Warrior Forum WSO’s…

    Property is a mug’s game, and I know because I own a rental property. Sure, on paper it’s a winner, but it’s funny these gurus never tell you about tenants who fall behind in the rent, or how much money you’ll need to fix broken boilers, or how crap letting agencies are :(.

    Anyway, when you pray, move your feet…

    • Dave says:


      Mad wasn’t it. I did find it fascinating like you.

      Fancy a lodger 😉

    • Kelly says:

      Amen – I thought I’d be set with having a beach rental property in Florida. Ended up selling the place this year, after paying the rental manager, repairs, insurance and taxes, I barely made enough to buy groceries.

  20. Mutri says:

    Make money by telling people how to make money??
    ya ya ya…

  21. Dee Foster says:

    I guess you can call me a personal development fanatic and it has become even a part of my day job in some respects.

    While I don’t subscribe to some of the “weird” stuff that goes on in the world of self help because it borderlines too close to New Age, I will say that the change in my mindset from that of an employee to that of an entrepreneur earned me 3 promotions in a postion that was not meant to be promotable. I definitely believe that the most important thing to develop is the right mindset and then action will not be a issue. As Jim Rohn used to say, If we spend 90% working on ourselves, the busienss will take care of itself.

    • Dave says:


      Congratulations on the promotions, that is excellent. Mindset and attitude are very important, you are right. The only problem I had was that it was as if these people were convinced they were going to be rich just by believing. It has to include actually taking the appropriate action as well.

      And I know that you are a Lady of action Dee 😉

  22. jared says:

    @Quinton, Switchfoot, I love that song. Good reference.

    I’ve read RDPD, Richest Man in Babylon, and a few others. I think they all have something to offer. But as many others have said, no book in the world will change a thing if you never take action.

    Many others have discussed hope here as well; the human condition. For many, self included at a point in my life, having HOPE was better than the disappointment of attempting something and failing.

    As long as I have hope, I have something. If I try and fail, then I’m left with nothing and really screwed. The problem is a lot of people can be stuck there indefinitely.

    For a long time there were two things I hated the most; the way things were and change.

    So I was stuck, buying books, reading things, but taking very little action. Then life just got too hard to manage and I reached a point of severe desperation. After making a turning point, decision, followed by massive action, nothing seemed impossible and no action too uncomfortable. To be living was all that counted and anything else was just gravy.

    I don’t think there’s anything wrong with people using knowledge they have to make a living.

    I’ve always enjoyed the Keys To Life by Will Smith: Reading and Running.

    I’m a big believer in when the student is ready, the teacher will appear. I’ve been working on a book for years now. And finally took off 10 days here over the holidays to finish it. A few weeks ago I met a fellow IM’er online and we met up for coffee.

    He suggest I read “The Millionaire Messenger” by Brendon Burchard. So I picked up a copy. Amazing book in my opinion. But it was the action I took, getting out into the world and interacting with another human being that pushed me in that direction. Action. It’s as if I opened that book just at the right time. Although I was already in the process of action, it validated that I’m on the right path and helped me in the process.

    But the key to any of this (which we all know) is that it’s all about taking action. Yes, a lot of people can regurgitate the same message (MMO, how to be rich, etc.) but maybe some of them also come at a time where their message is presented in a different way. In a way that it can connect with someone different or in a way that can motivate them to finally take action.

    Three frogs are sitting on a log, one decides to jump. How many are left?

    … three. He only made a decision.

    If I had the power to give any gift, it would be the gift of desperation. Would I sell it… maybe. But it’s something that I even struggle with now. I have a subscriber list that I’m very apprehensive about selling products to. I give out a lot of information for free based on experiences (not opinions) because I love the feedback and relationships that are created. But I even struggle with the idea of charging them for my book… OK, not a lot of struggling but some. LOL But it makes it easier when you sincerely want to help people and they start asking you for a book.

    There’s nothing wrong with charging people for what you know or have learned. But there can also be a fuzzy line between helping others and taking advantage of them. Their life should be better off for having listened to your message. Even though it should be about service more than the money. But the money can also allow you to get a message out to more people, help more people. Not take advantage of them.

    Great thought provoking article Dave. Thanks for taking the time to share and all the great comments in here.

    • Dave says:

      Thanks for such a great comment Jared, inspiring and thoughtful stuff.

      You are right, it comes down to being able to take action. And the more of it the better. Desperation is certainly a motivating factor, I know, I was there.

      I think the problem comes when people are made to believe in something by somebody when in reality it is simply not going to happen. A position that is totally impossible to predict in some cases, but not all. And that is the problem with these Gurus, giving people hope and expectations that are simply not a reality. Is it their fault though?

      Therein lies the quandary.

      I am totally with you on there being nothing wrong with charging for your knowledge, but that fuzzy line is certainly an issue. I guess it just comes down to what we truly believe to be the right thing. Fine for us good Guys, but a nightmare when it can be someone with less than stellar ethics at the helm directing the way people believe their lives can be led.